Orion ST80 or Celestron Astromaster 130 EQ

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mandaragit
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Orion ST80 or Celestron Astromaster 130 EQ

Post by mandaragit »

Hi Guys!

I was wondering if you guys can give me some advice on my current situation. First of all, I am now living back in the Philippines after 5 years in Singapore (thanks Singapore!) and I am in astro heaven with regards to my local sky (I live in the province far,far,far away from city lights). My humble Galileoscope I bought from Joo Beng (my first and only telescope since 2009) has been collecting photons every clear night I get, bad focuser and flimsy tripod and all. I have finally decided to upgrade and buy a small decent scope that my limited budget can afford (only 550 to 600 SGD), I was thinking Orion ST80 (with some accessories) on a sturdy tripod. My timing is also great as my parents will be visiting my sisters in Singapore at the end of the month so I can order from Astrobargains and let my parents bring back the scope when they come home after 1 week. I initially wanted the starblast but I don't think my parents can handle the big box at the airport and I am afraid the customs here in the philippines will give them a huge import tax.

So I was pretty set on getting the ST80 until I visited Manila today... While window shopping on one of the big malls here in Manila, I discovered that Celestron has now a distributor here in the Philippines ('Cutting Edge' located on some of the big name malls here). I eagerly went inside and found out that they are selling mostly the PowerSeeker refractors, the Astromaster and NextStar SE series. The 4SE is pretty much out of my budget as well as the 6SE and 8SE, so I started looking for reviews on the net about the AstroMaster 130 EQ and I mostly found negative reviews from Cloudynights but a few scattered positive ones. I am really not too keen on the PowerSeeker Refractors.

Basically, the price I will pay for the ST80 is almost the same if I will get the AstroMaster 130 EQ here in the Philippines (i big difference in apperture)... what would you guys get if you had to choose between the two? Many thanks in advance for the help and I am very very sorry for the long post!

Clear skies and enjoy the rest of your day!

Best REgards,
Maurice
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orly_andico
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Post by orly_andico »

Nah, you're better off getting an APO from William Optics. The older Orion scopes (like the ST80 and my 100ED) are mechanically quite crude, you will be unhappy.

Check out this one..
http://www.williamoptics.com/wo_shop/ca ... cts_id=500

It is $550 inclusive of shipping (that's USD) so in SGD a bit more than your budget but that is way above a crappy ST80 optically.

I believe they ship to Philippines directly but you will have to deal with Philippines customs. You can have it shipped to SG and pay the 7% GST.

James Kevin Ty at www.astroleaguephils.org might be able to help you, I understand he also bought some stuff from William Yang directly.

That said, I've hand-carried my William Optics Z70 in and out of Manila and customs never bothered me. Of course it looks used and all (because it is used).

Or, actually a better idea, try to find a used telescope. If you don't want to risk it with AstroMart or CloudyNights, just check out this forum. You can ask some of your friends here in SG to buy it for you and carry it back to Manila. So long as it looks used the Customs guys probably will not bother you. And of course there's always the "pwedeng bang pag-usapan ito" line.. which I have never tried, honestly.

Oh, and (I hope the mods will not see this as excessively self-promoting) you will almost certainly need a mount to go with your scope, unless you like dobsonians. I have a Vixen Polaris lying around and I'll be in Manila on the 24th - 26th this month. If you are interested (and can wait) I can carry it there (PM me if you're interested). I don't have a spare scope lying around though! :-P
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orly_andico
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Post by orly_andico »

check this out - http://www.singastro.org/viewtopic.php?t=9724

Gary's 127mm Mak. If not yet sold. Given your budget it would still give you some money for a mount. Of course it's a Mak and its LONG (optically). But I'm sure its a pleaser for planets.

There's also this guy in Manila, Alex Lacson absindex@yahoo.com who does telescope buy-and-sell. He's a nice fellow but most of the stuff he buys (from the US) and re-sells is entry-level gear. For your budget you can get some pretty decent stuff if you're willing to buy used.
Last edited by orly_andico on Tue Aug 02, 2011 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Gary
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Post by Gary »

@orly: Ok. Since you mentioned it, you now have to explain what is "pwedeng bang pag-usapan ito". :) From your photos, your WO doesnt look used. LOL. Someone should invent a used-look skin wrap for OTAs soon to clear customs. :)

@mandarajit: No doubt budget is important. But you may also want to find out what you really prefer to see in the short to mid term, e.g. widefield star clusters, high zoom lunar-planetary, DSOs..etc. That answer may further to help you justify what you scope you want to buy and whether paying a bit beyond your original budget is worth it or not.
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"The importance of a telescope is not how big it is, how well made it is.
It is how many people, less fortunate than you, got to look through it."
-- John Dobson.
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orly_andico
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Post by orly_andico »

"pwede bang pag-usapan ito" = "can we talk about this?"

it is code for all public servants in Manila (e.g. customs, police, etc.) when you indicate that you are willing to bribe them.

that said, I've never managed to say those words (I guess I'm not corrupt enough).

To add to what Gary says...

If you buy gear "piecemeal" you will end up with a lot of crap if you want to upgrade later. I'm a fine shining example of that (this is why I have 3 mounts).

Since you are in the province (which province?) you can actually maximize a larger scope. I would say a 5" at a minimum, Gary's Mak is a good choice because it's small enough that you won't hate carrying it around. Its drawback is the long focal length which means you cannot get "rich field" views. I suggest get some binoculars for the rich field..
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mandaragit
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Post by mandaragit »

Hi guys, I really appreciate all the advice!

@orly: PM'ed you about the Polaris. The scope Garry's selling looks good, I'll have to consider it, but I see myself as a wide-field star-clusters kind of guy. I like to look at planets but not as much as the open clusters and such. By the way, did you buy a scope from WO and had them shipped it to SG? If yes, how long did it take to get there?
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orly_andico
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Post by orly_andico »

Maurice, I had W-O ship the scope to SG directly, it was via EMS. W-O is based in Taiwan so it was a short wait (less than a week). It's actually a shorter trip to Manila, according to James he was able to get a discount from W-O (because W-O offered free worldwide shipping back then) because Taiwan-PH shipping is much less than Taiwan-US.
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cloud_cover
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Post by cloud_cover »

Hi Maurice,
The AM-130 and the ST-80 are very different scopes: The AM-130 is a newtonian reflector and the other is an achromat refractor.
In terms of setup and maintainence, the AM-130 will demand more: It will have some cooldown effects if you're bringing it from a warm house to a cool night (not sure if where you are gets cold!). Also, being an f/5 reflector, it will benefit from a coma corrector such as a Baader MPCC or Paracorr, which adds expense. Also, collimation is a very important factor as an uncollimated scope, particularly a fast reflector (low f number) will not show nice, sharp views. Do check online how frequently the AM-130 requires re-collimation (I suspect it will require it rather frequently and collimation equipment also costs some money)
The ST-80, like all refractors, is generally fuss free in terms of setup and maintainence.
In visual use, the AM-130, due to its central obstruction of 34%, stars will not appear as pinpoint as in the ST-80 at higher powers. This is also partly a personal preference but more people prefer the "refractor-like" views generally. Also, because it is harder to grind a larger mirror to an equal spec as compared to a smaller glass lens and given that there is known variation in mirror quality from mass producers, the refractor is likely to give better contrast when viewing objects.
However, the AM-130 is a larger scope hence images will appear brighter. Assuming perfect mirrors with a reflectivity of 92% (very large assumption), it should equate in brightness to a 112mm refractor. Also, the ST-80, being an achromat, will produce chromatic abberation in brighter objects.
I have a suggestion: Kochu is selling is WO 90 for $600. If the budget allows, why not get that? Its a rather well regarded, almost- APO (technically. Practically its almost completely color free) refractor and in future should you decide to dabble in photography will sedrve as an excellent astrograph as well :)
DON'T PANIC
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orly_andico
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Post by orly_andico »

Yikes! $600 for a WO90? I suddenly acquired an irrational urge as well. :-P

Maurice, I suggest you grab that since the cost of a new WO80 is about the same. If you don't I suspect Kevin will beat you to it.

But then again I have my 100ED with WO focuser, so it's 90% of a WO...
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mandaragit
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Post by mandaragit »

@cloud_cover: thank you very much for the explanation, I really appreciate it!

As for the WO90 kouchu is selling, I am really considering it but something inside of me wants a brand new scoe :D
I believe it's reserved for viewing now, i'm thinking it a sign that I need a brand new scope hehehe.

by the way, I was browing the WO website and can see their new DDG focusers... what exactly are those and is it really usefull?
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