Alright, this is for sharing of your observation experience. Or, if you are arranging gatherings, star-gazing expeditions or just want some company to go observing together, you can shout it out here.
I think you guys should not have put the plastic bags to cover the lamposts. These are public property belonging to our neighbour to serve a purpose; i.e for safety of road users/pedestrian. The heat from the lamp may just ignite the plastic bag and causes accident.
We should at least shield the observation site by other means or worst, change location.
I share the same feeling with Lee... it is not very considerate to deny others the use of the street lamps at night. Hopefully not all lamps along the stretch of road outside the chalet are covered up. The traditional observing field just a few hundred meters up the road is darker and there are no street lamps albeit less convenient. Also I hope this time round we did not leave trash behind expecting them to be cleaned up magically after we leave.
We do it in the dark...
Portaball 12.5"
Takahashi Mewlon 210
William Optics 110ED
...and all night long!
I drove past the chalet looking for them on Sat night, and honestly, I didn't notice the lamp posts were covered with trash bags so I drove past the chalet. It was only AFTER I found them that I heard the flapping of the trash bags.
The roads along the way are already so dark, I don't think the covered lamps affected any drivers at all - anyway, even after they were covered, they were still shining "bright" for M;sian road standards.
I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but I just don't think it poses any inconvenience or affects the safety along that stretch of road.
Jeremy Ng
C8, CR-150HD, TMB 80 f/6
Orion SVP Intelliscope, AstroSlew I
Minolta Activa 12x50WA
Agree with Jeremy . It is not a busy road or highway and by Malaysia standards , it is already a well lit road. Please remember that malaysia still have entire highway stretch unlited with streetlights.
Hi,
IMHO, It's not about whether is the road busy or is the road already very well lit or not... It's about respect our neighbour country and stay out of trouble... especially there are students in the group, so it's the organizer responsibility to make sure they are not in any kind of trouble in a foreign country... will be very difficult to explain to their parent if get into any kind of trouble because of this and they might get "red carded" to join any form of future astronomical activity.
Anyway, if any accident happen at the location or the lamp caught fire, it's just too easy for them to point the finger at us... even it's not cause by the black plastic bag.
By the way, if we can enjoy the light polluted sky in Singapore, I think we still will enjoy the Mersing sky even without cover the lamp. Also, let's make sure we keep a good impression to the local community, so that they'll not worry about us observing at their backyard.
Just my S$0.02.
Have a nice day.
Yang Weixing "The universe is composed mainly of hydrogen and ignorance."
Sam Lee wrote:Agree with Jeremy . It is not a busy road or highway and by Malaysia standards , it is already a well lit road. Please remember that malaysia still have entire highway stretch unlited with streetlights.
Yes stretches of roads are unlit in M'sia (and in almost all developed countries) but where there are street lamps, they have been installed for a purpose. Covering up street lamps can be viewed as selfish and arrogance by the local population. Remember u are there as a guest and nothing more.
We do it in the dark...
Portaball 12.5"
Takahashi Mewlon 210
William Optics 110ED
...and all night long!
no worries. the trash bags have been REMOVED. period. as for trash, we did not leave anything behind. even if i did not remind them, i would help SEE and DO the cleaning up normally.
Here are some deeper thoughts about the recent expeditions and perhaps the same would be applied to future ones:
Please note that the open fields are more than a few hundred metres away, it is closer to 1.5-2km (having jogged this distance over there for a few times). Because this expedition comprises of mainly 60-70% newbies, and chalet transport is limited to just a hatchback car, it was almost impossible to ferry everyone over to the open fields. The most one could do is to use the existing car to ferry equipment, and have everyone taking a leisurely stroll there and back the next morning. A briefing was conducted the moment I reached the chalet for EVERYONE, and notified them of this issue (and more than one time). They had a choice to either stargaze at the open fields or at the chalet. Eventually, they made a choice of staying in the chalet for observing, which IMHO, was more convenient since they could retreat back to their rooms if the weather was bad (and it did), or for any other reasons (easy access to their belongings, etc). From past experiences (both personal and gathered as feedback from the participants), the existing lights emanating from both sodium-based lamp-posts would be a substantial annoyance to southern sky observing. As this time round, it was the season where one would observe the southern sky due to the well populated areas of Crux, Centaurus and Carina, it was particularly more important that there was no light-pollution hindrance. Also note that since these are sodium-based lamps with an emission at a monochromatic wavelength of 590nm (which is also sensitive to the human eye), it would be a relevant candidate for close-proximity light pollution. With the lamps covered, it was as good as being in the open fields, less the surrounding peripheral trees and scrubs. If it was the season of Pisces Austrinus, etc where the southern sky was more "barren", this may not have been necessary, although it would still be less "optimized" for general viewing.
As for the fear of sodium lamp heating up, the black trash bags method (as you can see from the photo) are allowed to hang moderately loosely at its bottom end, and culminated with a bottle weight. The volume within is big enough (and also open at its end) in such a way that heat is dissipated effectively. Also, if you note from the posts, there was presence of constant draft throughout the course of both nights, which would enable the lamps to be cool throughout anyway.
As for the comment on participant safety, all of them have been briefed based on verbal and written methods about the DOs and DON'Ts of the trip. If you search back the archives here on previous ogranised trips to Mersing, this have been practiced throughout. However, there is only so much the organisers can do, since the participants have to decide and the right to know what is good for them and to heed our advice or not. This ranges from not roaming beyond the chalet premises (except if they choose to stay at the open fields), no alchohol consumption, movement in twos at least, notifying someone if they are heading elsewhere, etc. And in cases of emergencies, we have a list of second-point-of-contact phone numbers so that their families could be notified. In cases of medical emergencies, the nearest hospital in Mersing would be used.
Lastly, in addressing the point of leaving a good impression based on our activities held in another country, again, this has been reminded to the participants over and over again, both past and present. And like any large group, there would be bound to be litter, but as said in the prior post, for us organisers, even though it is a dirty job, and we can't help it if people forget, we will do the cleaning up and packing miscellaneous items eventually (including used mosquito coils). It has been noted in the past that the open fields 'do not litter' practice has been adhered to as well, but sometimes we still see litter left by others not from our group, and it is something beyond our capabilities, or foreseeable circumstances.
I'm confused. Is this the usual chalet, or the new one which had wonderful breakfast?
[80% Steve, 20% Alfred] ------- Probability of Clear Skies = (Age of newest equipment in days) / [(Number of observers) * (Total Aperture of all telescopes present in mm)]
"The universe is composed mainly of hydrogen and ignorance." 
