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croys
Age: 33
Joined: 30 Dec 2008
Posts: 503
Location: River Valley, Singapore
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Unless these are some copy (unlikely) these eyepieces are made in Japan and available under different brands. I have some (not Baader) and they are very good.
Francis: the Orthoscopic design is simple, has few surfaces and doesn't introduce (or correct) many aberrations. They are fairly easy to make and to make well. They are also small and lightweight. So, they are good value.
However, the field of view is limited (generally about 40 degrees), and they do not work well with short focal ratio scopes, unless you use a barlow. The eye-relief varies a lot. It is very short at short focal lengths, so you can't use glasses.
Most people use them for high resolution viewing of the Moon and planets, and prefer eyepieces with a wider field of view for deep sky objects like nebulae. Having said that, I occasionally use mine for deep sky as the contrast is so good, and my Pentax eyepieces are large and heavy, so I might not take them on a trip.
Regards,
Stuart
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croys
Age: 33
Joined: 30 Dec 2008
Posts: 503
Location: River Valley, Singapore
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This is depressing, now Baader are starting the pointless marketing hyperbole:
"Through their many years of eyepiece design and production, combined with their close associations with Zeiss, Baader Planetarium has acquired a unique in-depth knowledge of eyepiece design and fabrication. Baader set out to deliver an eyepiece that is worthy of comparison to the Zeiss Abbe, while still remaining affordable for the amateur. The result is the Baader Genuine Orthoscopic."
Right. Despite the fact these orthos have been available for years before Baader started selling them.
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Francis
Age: 57
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
Posts: 12
Location: Bedok
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Stuart,
Thanks for the advice.
Guess this may not be suitable as I'm wearing glasses.
Have an MS 1300mm tube.
Our rather short experience with this new found hobby seems 'educational' in the B&S -Buy & Sell aspect. The amount of softsell / hardsell is simply amazing.
I met an seller/distributor and was looking a a 'new' brand V 300$ Zoomer advertised. Peeped thru the EP and saw 'spider webs' on the lens. Seller looked at it and could not find anything wrong, no fungus nor anything & non chalantly said its an 'old' new piece. One of us must hv been blind. But he has many other products which seems 'good'.
Level of integrity for some sellers is sadly lacking. Try talking to some 'buying' oseas and wanting to share posting costs. Either my maths must be subzero and perhaps an ex 'marine'.
Your advice is much appreciated!
Guys, keep eyes peeled and hold on to hard earned $$ before parting with it to charlatans & what hv we here..... in S'pore ?
Not all bad, had a couple of good encounters too.
With Thanks & Regards.
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croys
Age: 33
Joined: 30 Dec 2008
Posts: 503
Location: River Valley, Singapore
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Hi Francis,
Yes, sadly there is a lot of pointless marketing hype in this hobby. I'm a bit disappointed with Baader. Up til now, as far as I'm aware, they've been relatively hype free. I have a few of their products, and they are generally good quality (except for the thread on my Moon and Skyglow filter, grr...).
I don't see why they can't just say "these are nice Orthos made in Japan". They have to rattle on about their "close association(s)" with Zeiss. This is just name dropping. Note how they are not claiming that they worked with Zeiss on eyepiece design for these or any other eyepieces, but they are definitely insinuating it. Sneaky.
But why bother with all this marketing nonsense? Baader have a good name. They introduced the Hyperions, which many people like and were genuinely a bit different and very flexible. The solar film is cheap and great, the nice clock lock adapters, the super expensive Zeiss binoviewers, etc...
I don't want to be seen as picking on Baader. I generally like their stuff, but this advertising is a bit crappy. Other companies get up to this, and Baader are definitely not the worst. Much larger companies have made ridiculous claims in the past, though they seem to have toned down.
For example, WO also marketed the Megrez II 80FD as "fluorite". It was quickly found out not to use fluorite, and then there was nonsense over who designed which of their lenses. They stopped marketing it as fluorite, but the resellers didn't. Again, a shame, they should've just said "these are decently made relatively inexpensive doublets". But they had to get the magic "fluorite" word in there, like the pointless "semi-APO" in previous scopes. I think they learned a lot from that and now their marketing is more realistic.
Adding to this is the fact that many resellers don't seem to know much about optics, telescope design, or it seems sometimes, the hobby in general!
BTW in case there's any doubt - I'm not pointing the finger at Remus here, he's clearly a genuine amateur astronomer and is doing his best to help introduce more products to Singapore, which is great.
So far, I haven't had a bad astro shopping experience in Singapore, but I generally know what I'm looking for before I go. I've found various online forums to be very useful in figuring out what is hype. It takes time though, and is a barrier to newcomers.
Cheers,
Stuart
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Francis
Age: 57
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
Posts: 12
Location: Bedok
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Guess beyond the hardware, its the fascination and discovery viewers get observing and learning about all that 'wonders' up there.
But such marketing ploys used does seem exaggerated, worse, misrepresented ..simply takes the 'joy' out of this hobby.
BTW: the seller for the Baader in this instance is not Remus.
Have A Great Tiger Year !!
Cheers.
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weixing
Super Moderator
Age: 37
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 4181
Location: (Tampines) Earth of Solar System in Orion Arm of Milky Way Galaxy in Local Group Galaxies Cluster
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Hi,
I move some of the posts from the buy and sell section to this new thread.
Anyway, there had been a discussion on this eyepiece in the past. See this thread if you are interested: http://www.singastro.org/viewtopic.php?t=4790
Have a nice day.
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_________________
Yang Weixing
 "The universe is composed mainly of hydrogen and ignorance."
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acc
Administrator
Age: 36
Joined: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 2115
Location: R.Valley
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_________________
We do it in the dark...
Portaball 12.5"
WO 80FD 10th Annv
...and all night long!
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rcj
Vendor
Age: 34
Joined: 28 Sep 2003
Posts: 1932
Location: Eunos
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Hi Stuart, Francis:
To answer some of your queries and also offer some input and experience, the Baader Genuine Orthoscopics are made in Japan for Baader. As for the actual OEM company that manufactures these eyepieces, it could be Kasai Trading, but this piece of information was based a couple of years back, as these eyepieces have been around for quite some time, and known worldwide for its maturity and sharpness property. Agreeing with Stuart, eye relief is not fantastic, but if you are buying an eyepiece or in particular, of the orthoscopic design, you may be more concerned with on-axis sharpness, and these fellas can excel in this very well - and hence used in planetary observations, contrast-related activities compared to higher priced premium planetary eyepieces like Pentax XOs, XPs, Zeiss, etc. As for how Baader markets their product(s), it is beyond authorized dealers like us, though when it comes to answering questions from our customers, I'll make it a point to give as much information (and self experience with it where applicable) as I could.
Am sorry to hear of your experience here in Singastro, Francis, but this is also certainly not uncommon in the present internet world of buy/sell. I have bought eyepieces overseas that have never appeared in my hands eventually, and have also invested in expensive refractors with mediocre packaging. The important thing here, especially to fellow astro newbies when buying, is to know as much as possible, about the product that you wish to buy, or at least know the reputation of the seller where possible. Sometimes the first point can be difficult since we have lots of brands, and even the advertising content from the original product can sound very tempting (but could be hogwash) to the beginner. It would be best of course if you are allowed to try, but my advice would certainly be if you feel uncomfortable, don't buy it in the first place, especially if you did in any case, you probably may end up re-selling it here (the comunity is small!), and someone else will end up with the potential white elephant!
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_________________
Remus a.k.a Photon Bucket
http://www.celestialportraits.com
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croys
Age: 33
Joined: 30 Dec 2008
Posts: 503
Location: River Valley, Singapore
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Hi,
They are definitely not made by Kasai Trading - this is just a retailer (by all accounts a good one) that brings foreign astro goods (mainly Russian) into Japan and also badges Japanese and other products for sale.
The old-style design "volcano top" orthos have been around for a long, long time in Japan and from University Optics. The newer style have been available in the past few years from University Optics, Kasai Trading, Kokusai Koukhi, other shops in Japan and now Baader. They are supposed to have superior coatings in addition to the improved barrel design - eyecups, par-focal, etc..
Stuart
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