NTU/NUS Astronomy Challenge 2006

[coolgeek84]

Hi there Jin Peng, You can pay on the day itself. =)

Hi Yang Beng,

Dude, seems like you have decided to pass a "verdict" about how NTU students handle the scopes.

I am sorry to see that you have stated some facts but not all the facts. You had coined them in such a way that it seems like ALL the people who handled it were mishandling it. Obviously you had not noticed the OTA in my lap during the whole ferry ride because I was afraid of the vibrations affecting the OTA and collimation. You had also not noticed that I had handled the scope without passing it to anyone most of the time.

Its obvious to me that you had either mistakenly stated only the negative points or had purposely done so for God only knows what reasons.

The trip that you had joined us for was a trip to Pulau Redang. It was 3 years back in 2003 if I am not wrong. Back then I was the Research and Resource Manager of NTUAS. My jobscope includes everything directly related to scopes. Handling/Maintainence/Observations and all those.

Its obvious from your post that you either have little or no experience in terms of handling people who handle the scopes. And both of them are two very different things. The club's scopes are about 12 years old each. But 12 years of being present in a Club is different then 12 years of being present in your/my house.

In these 12 years it is highly likely that more then 50% of the people were seeing or handling the scopes for the very first time in their lives. I have no control over that. Yes I can shout and prevent people from touching or handling or using the scope by themselves. But that will mean that I am preventing my Society and myself from achieving the goal that I set out for: To let everyone have a chance to see what astronomy is really about. I don't want to restrict myself from achieving this just because the scope will be damaged in the long run.

Which is more important? Taking care of the society's members or taking care of the scope? Running a Society is an entirely different thing as many here will agree with me. Owning one's own scope and maintaining it in pristine condition is another story.

I agree that they might have dragged it when I had passed it to them. Telling them to handle carefully and them following the rules is different once again.

And for your info, feedbacks don't start with a negative tone. So you can't classify your "comment" as a mere feedback.

Thank you,

[chrisyeo]

Hi Arjun,

Thanks for your reply. Although I don't think the initial comment was particularly negative in tone, I think you have made your point. I am sure every club tries their very best to maintain the scopes they have. Perhaps we can all just put this little matter behind us? Thanks.

Wish you all the best with this year's astrochallenge.

Chris

[Canopus Lim]

Hi Arjun,

Sorry for misunderstanding some parts of the story. Anyway, I am definitely not against you or NTU astro at all, why should I since I was from NTU right? I guess it was unintentional. Lastly, I understand your point.

Yang Beng

[acc]

I think Yang Beng only meant well, and didn't sound harsh or overly critical in his post. Let's get back to topic.

[rcj]

hey guys! sorry for coming in this late, not noticed the direction this thread has apparently taken. I have seen both the C6 and C8. The C8 is really in a bad shape no doubt, but am aware that the institution is already getting a new one. As for the C6, it is still a good scope. I used to have one myself, the exact same setup, and can see I have gotten pretty stunning views of M45, Lagoon, etc with it in those Malaysian trips. The sliding focuser will need a little tuning up again, perhaps the mirror will really need to be collimated with secondary, but I believe the setup will then after be ready to go.
As for the issue of scope handling when it comes to institution versus privately owned equipment, it is needless to say that private ones will also be treated dearly since we ourselves paid for them...nevertheless this does not mean that institutional equipment should be treated unfairly, or in most cases, out of sheer mishandling...the issue here is more of awareness and education of the society members and is the due responsilibility of the society committee or president or logistcis head to impart this action to those who are tasked to handle the scopes while transportation and setups. Back in the past, I have seen cases of refractor lying on the sand on the beach with no cap on, a hand carried C8 in a drizzle, and lots more similar episodes. People are just unaware or maybe think that the equipment "can take it", so it's really our duty as the president, logistics head, or committee to make sure that equipment are handled properly. This message does not go out to any one institution with an astronomy society (that has equipment), it really goes out to all. Let's do our part and make observational astronomy a pleasant and lasting experience in years to come!
Remus

[Tachyon]

Yang Beng is a nice guy, I'm sure he was not malicious when he made the comment.

Anyway, back to the event, maybe you could put in a question or two on "Star Test" results and present a mis-collimated image for them to guess?

Cheers!

[ChaosKnight]

Allow me to explain why i was pissed off when i saw Canopus's comments. From the statements, one could conclude:

(1) NTUAS R&R "do not understand scopes or know the significance of rough handling when it comes to optical alignment."

And

(2) NTUAS R&R let couples "literally just drag the C6 Newt OTA on the floor of the bus and they don't even know what is inside that tube."

So what are we, a bunch of ignorant people?

Next he backpedalled and downgraded the comments to mere "feedback". Now it's no longer R&R's fault, but some unidentified people's. And it's all in the past, so lets just forget what was said, right?

The way i see it, feedback is directed privately at the society, not put up in a public forum. Negative comments that come, what, 2 yrs late? in a public forum is, to me, plain bashing.

But after all has been said, i suppose we should all move on. And thanks to the guys who are diffusing the situation. i wouldn't post anymore on this matter.

[jermng]

I'm probably getting myself into unnecessary trouble here, but don't you think NTU Astro members/committee are way over-reacting to this issue?

Your replies and reaction to this issue reflect your ability and maturity in handling criticism, your confidence as a committee and the esteem you hold towards your society.

As many before me have pointed out, Yang Beng's comments did not sound at all offensive and on the contrary could have been used as pointers to improve the handling and operation of the society's equipment. Regardless of whether it was a fair statement, all he did was point out what he personally observed during a trip 2/3 years ago and I believe the only reason why he brought it up was because we were on the topic of damaged equipment in your society.

As he has already mentioned, he had no intention of slamming or "bashing" the society, but despite his and other moderators and administrators efforts to ease the tension, there is still a continous string of defensive comments that have turned offensive in more ways than one.

I believe most of you have not seen internet "bashing" in the real world. It amounts to more than the sharing of a personal experience and a suggestion of how something might be improved.

It might be time to stop taking comments and suggestions negatively and try looking at things more positively. See if some change could help.

Once again, I know this is probably none of my business and I do not personally know Canopus Lim, but some of the posts here could really have been better thought through before being posted.

I appreciate the efforts that NTU Astro Committee have put in for their society and can see their passion in defending their organisation. This is to be greatly applauded and I'm sure your society will go a long way if this energy continues.

Just my 2 cents and I have no intention to offend anybody or create greater misunderstanding. Just stating what I think.

Back to topic, it's great seeing more Astro programs/competitions held by schools/institutions in Spore ... it looks really promising. Wish I had something like that when I was still in school ...

[acc]

Guys, I have locked down this thread as it doesn't relate to the topic header anymore. Please start a new thread for anything related to the Astronomy Challenge. Other issues can be handled off-line.